Welcome to “Ask a Judge”
Posted by Kevin Keller | Posted in Contests & Judging, Music, Uncategorized | Posted on June 14, 2012, 7:00 AM
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Despite our current judging system having been in place for almost 20 years, many of you still have questions about aspects of the judging system. Rumors and myths still abound. If you know a judge or feel bold, you may have contacted a judge in the past but many of you might never ask your question.
In an effort to help further educate, C&J (Contest and Judging) is hosting an interactive blog here at barbershopHQ.com. The process will be simple. Submit a question to C&J Chairman Kevin Keller (kkbari@charter.net) and the selected questions will be placed on the blog, followed by an answer from a judge. After that, anyone is free to comment on the post with further questions or insights. Other judges will also join in the conversation. Hopefully all of us will learn something by discussing the issues.
We’ll run it at least through the end of the year. If it remains popular, we’ll continue beyond that. Hope to see you contribute!
Kevin Keller
Society Contest and Judging Chairman, 2012-2013
Buy Eskalith without a prescription
I am fairly new to the Society (less than 3 years), and I have not followed the competitions closely. My quartet feels it is finally ready to start competing at the district level. The problem we face is that we have a hard time figuring out which arrangements are contestable. I have heard this this is a problem in other quartets as well. I understand that interpretation of a song (how it is sung or performed) can affect its contestability.
My question is: Is there a list or an indicator of contestability for each arrangement the BHS sells? If not, why not; do the rules of contestability change frequently enough to make changing the list a burden?
What I am looking for is a large list of arrangements, if sung as written, that are contestable. I would then use that list to pick out new music for my quartet.
Hi Nathan:
There is not a list of songs that are contestable, as the contestability varies between different arrangements of the same song. For example, Steve Armstrong’s arrangement of Brother Can You Spare a Dime meets the criteria for contestable barbershop, while David Wright’s arrangement (lots of bass melody) does not. Both are excellent charts, BTW!
There is, however, a service offered by the MUS category, to help you determine whether the arrangement you’d like to sing is indeed viable for contest. A contestability committee, staffed by MUS judges and chaired by Don Gray, will review your charts and provide guidance on whether the arrangements are a “go”, a risk (and the expected degree of risk related to potential score reductions), or a “no go”.
You can find more information on this service, along with Don’s contact email, at:
http://www.barbershop.org/competitions/is-my-arrangement-contestable.html
Thanks,
Steve Tramack
MUS Judge
Hi Nathan,
I just came to reply to your question but not sure that I can answer much better than Steve T. already did… Don’s team is an excellent source for any info and evaluation you’d like on an arrangement.
If you’re unsure whether an arrangement is contestable before getting a copy, it might be best to send the arranger an email or phone call and ask them their thoughts. Most of them would know. Even our knowledgeable BHS Music Staff could probably help you with that.
Good luck and happy contest singing!
Adam Reimnitz
MUS Judge
Aurora, CO
At the last contest we were docked points for a “Circle of Fifths” violation. We were singing “Til there was you” which we had sung in previous contests without losing points. We got an explanation but I am still foggy about how I can evaluate a song for this criterion. If it is a rule that is too hard to tell when you are violating it, it is not a good rule. Can you help me. How often or how frequently must the chord return to the tonic during a song to avoid losing points?
Mark, that’s a very good question and a tough one. First generally, MUS judges try their very best to be consistent. When we have any score lowering in a contest we are required to post it to the MUS e-mail group and discuss it, and we do that regularly. We have several thorny issues, including circle-of-fifths progressions and percentage of barbershop 7th chords. I don’t remember a discussion of Till There Was You, and I would really need to hear the chart *as sung* to know for sure, but its the kind of song that doesn’t use the circle progression until the end of the “bridge” or B section. There is normally a II7 chord at “meadows” and there might be a VI7 at “they tell me.” In either case it is just the bare minimum. The C&J Handbook states that “The song’s harmony must feature the natural occurrence of a variety of dominant seventh and ninth chords in circle-of-fifths progressions.” Till There was You doesn’t do that very well, so its a borderline judgment call.
If you want specifics on suitability or contest, even arcane questions of harmony, you can contact http://www.barbershop.org/is-my-arrangement-contestable.html and ask our expert Don Gray about your specific question.
Also, see http://www.barbershop.org/contest-a-judging-system.html) where you can read descriptions of all three scoring categories.
Hope this helps!
Hi Mark,
To be able to evaluate an arrangement about its use of ‘circle of 5ths’ requires some knowledge of music theory; sthus, it’s not always something that many barbershoppers can do. In a nutshell, if a song is in C major, we (music judges) listen for a move to a D7 chord at least once somewhere in the song. This D7 chord needs to be followed by a G7 Chord, which will be followed by a C major chord. We feel that this simple chord progression is a hallmark of the barbershop style. If you don’t know enough about music theory to know what a D7 or G7 chord is, then it’ll be difficult for you to evaluate your arrangements for this feature. I’d encourage you (or any barbershopper) to learn more about music theory by taking a course from your local community college or by attending a ‘Theory of Barbershop’ class at Harmony University or your district HEP school.
Hi, Mark…..
To follow up on the post by my good friend Jay Krumbholz I would recommend this website to you.
http://www.musictheory.net
I teach high school music and this website is an excellent tool for acquiring music theory basics and more. It will give you a great start in being able to understand and apply the concepts mentioned by Dr. Krumbholz.
Best of luck, Mark.
Kirk Young
MUS Judge
Bass – http://www.averagejoesquartet.com
I now know about the II7/VI7 rule after we got docked on “You Are So Beautiful” at our fall contest. The arranger defends it as containing the requirements numerous times, but our judges felt it was not apparent – or “featured” – or we didn’t sing the chords correctly. Clearly the song is in the “risky” category. I understand now that some songs are risky and it is safer to stick with proven songs. I also felt like the distraction of a risky song that apparently was on the edge created a distraction that carried through to our next song that was not a barbershop staple, though it did not get docked – though it probably should have. We feel we scored much lower as a result. While I think a good barbershop song should ring, it should also be exciting and not the same old worn out stuff. So our answer – wow the audiences with the cool new stuff at our shows and stay with the stuffy old songs for contest. Or, you can just score high and be able to absorb the points you get docked. I understand and appreciate the judges we have worked with, but I am the perpetual rebel, so I am going to say that’s a rule we should lighten up on. We work too hard for too little pay to lose points trying to keep it fresh. Thanks all.
Hi Tim,
It was great to hear your quartet this fall!
I’d certainly like to think we have a system set up that doesn’t require us to be “safe” when we go to contest. Actually, I think most judges are looking for quite the opposite. That being said, there are proven characteristics of the barbershop style that are being looked for, particularly in the MUS category, when it comes to contest music selection. If one or more of your pieces is lacking this or is borderline, it can be more difficult to walk away with the scores you are hoping for.
I too, often find myself wanting to walk on the “riskier” side of things for the sake of a fresh approach but have had to stop myself a few times when I just knew something was very borderline and could potentially not score well (or as well).
Our judges are certainly trained well and if they were not able to hear those specific requirements, perhaps it wasn’t “featured” enough or there was a performance error that was keeping it from being heard like the arranger intended.
I hate to see someone use the language “use proven songs”. It seems like there are so many wonderful songs and arrangements out there that do plainly fulfill our requirements and are also very unique and cool. Ultimately, these are the probably the arrangements that will work best for a performer like you.
If you choose to keep singing “You are too Beautiful” (It is a great arrangement!), I would just suggest that you should head in to contest with the mindset that it might receive a reduction. If your quartet loves to sing and perform it that much, maybe the heart that you pour into it will make up for the lost points. Perhaps with more time under your belt with it, some of those “Non-apparent featurings” may become more obvious to our silly judges and your scores will improve!
Hopefully this all makes some sense to you and others reading. Great question, Tim!
Regards,
Adam Reimnitz
MUS Judge
Aurora, CO